The more I think about it, the more interesting this is -- maybe you should write it up for Medical Hypotheses or some other journal.
This might explain why top-tier athletes are so prone to vaccine injury, especially in aerobic sports. They run high levels of ER stress from exertion (a quick search turned up https://journals.lww.com/acsm-msse/Fulltext/2011/01000/Endoplasmic_Reticulum_Stress_Markers_and.4.aspx). They also generally have high levels of toxins, because they eat very high calorie diets, so will have high intakes of food toxins (polyunsaturated fats, excess retinol and beta-carotene, glyphosate, aluminum, fluoride); all of these toxins increase ER stress.
Of course we should measure ER stress before vaccination, and periodically afterwards... Just one more test we could have checked before vaccinating billions of people.
You've hit on everything I was going to include but kept it shorter for my own sanity. I was thinking of writing about measuring ER Stress markers (I mentioned an observational study that did so in COVID pneumonia patients) and I would hope that doctors who read this post may be inspired to think of such tests to conduct. Otherwise, I do have some in mind as well!
And I also included a literature review (I think in here as well) that mentioned ER Stress markers tend to increase in rigorous exercise, although it evens out afterwards which may indicate a slight beneficial role. But I will admit I didn't even take into consideration the athletes! And it would also require that timing of the vaccination be taken into account as well. So many variables, so many perspectives, and so few people being concerned!
I tend to be very hesitant in attributing autism to various causative agents, but I'll look into it and see what can be pieced together if possible. I wouldn't be surprised if there are plenty of factors to autism rather than one genetic factor but I always prefer to be hesitant in my thinking with respect to autism.
Lyons-Weiler wrote a book, The Environmental and Genetic Causes of Autism, that reviewed over 2,000 research papers, so he's pretty knowledgable. The genetic susceptibility is primarily to environmental toxins and nutritional deficiencies, we don't have "autism genes" per se. No individual genetic variant has high correlation.
Another good resource is vaccinepapers.org, which includes full-text copies of the research it cites.
For background rates, Blaxill and Olmstead's book is impeccable: Denial: How Refusing to Face the Facts about Our Autism Epidemic Hurts Children, Families, and Our Future
Thanks for the comment. I'll keep an open mind and perspective and I'll check those books out when possible. I think my backlog of books I should be reading is several dozen as of now, so maybe I should go back to reading some books!
Feb 24, 2022·edited Feb 25, 2022Liked by Modern Discontent
I went down a similar path in my cancer etiology proposal - that inducing a cell to churn out a protein without destroying it afterward (as a virus does during lysis) will probably result in metabolic disruption. I proposed metaplasia / conversion to secreting phenotypes (https://unglossed.substack.com/p/liquid-cancer) - but stress cascades make sense as well.
Spike is loaded with N, which has a role in folding quality checks via during-translation-glycosylation. I wonder if that would exacerbate or evade ER inflammatory signaling; the latter might make sense since viruses don't like inflammation. I haven't looked into the world of folding from the cell's side yet. ER stress as the etiology for myocarditis sounds like a promising angle. The Zhang citation is great (a lot of really good citations throughout) - though I'm having trouble determining how they are using some of the key phrases at first glance. Language barrier.
If mRNA is transfecting pituitary / pineal cells, then there's your blood-brain barrier bypassed as far as excreted spike. That's been my hunch as far as the neurological effects. This could also account for menstrual disruption (whether via spike or mRNA-metabolic-disruption), and has some really scary implications (rapid aging). *comment edited for typos
Man, there was one paper I was reading about cancer and ER stress. It's somewhere in my tabs...somewhere but I'd rather not misquote them. There are indications that the spike protein may trigger inflammatory signaling, but what would be interesting is if the folding of the protein and post-translational modification contributes in some manner. With UPR it appears that just checking if proteins are misfolded is enough to trigger UPR and ER Stress. Even with these papers there's still so much to cover.
I'll check that paper again. There is an issue of scientists not following similar nomenclature or using their own preferred terms which can make it confusing.
I tried looking into endometriosis, wondering if there may be accumulation of LNP within the reproductive tract. There is one study I saw examining ER Stress in endometriosis. The pituitary/pineal thought is interesting.
This has given me a lot to think about and I'll check out your cancer paper as well!
Edit Edit: I referred to the wrong paper! Sorry a lot of the names are blurring together! I thought you were referring to the Zha et. al. study. I'll examine the paper again and let me know if there's anything in particular that's confusing.
It's only confusing because I haven't done more than skim. The way they employ "ER stress" as a verb in multiple contexts makes it clear that it has to be read carefully (as any study should be anyway).
Thank you for this different perspective about the vaccines and covid infections. I appreciate it. 👍🏼💜
I have a BS biology and a minor in chemistry, and it would have really helped me to more clearly know what ER stood for (I had to really look for it) and a a short paragraph about that process of ER stress. (From the title I thought you were talking about doctors in the emergency room. 😄).
oh apologies! I guess at this point I was just thinking of it from the perspective of the Fluvoxamine lead up, so I assumed most people had ER as endoplasmic reticulum in mind! I'll make sure to be careful about that in the future. As you can tell I'm really not one to make good titles!
As I stated to Tim I'm usually hesitant to attribute autism to any causative agent. I did skim over your paper and I do appreciate that it does approach it from a multifactorial approach. I'll try to read it over when available. Even if it's a highly controversial topic I would at least like to examine it with as much nuance as possible.
No worries, it is lightly to be a result of my brain as well! Also, as a suggestion for future comments it may be easier to reply to the comment thread by clicking on the reply button underneath someone's comment. It'll help keep the conversation organized. Hope that helps!
I will have to re-read a couple more times as the complexities have sometimes overwhelmed my admittedly diminished capabilities to fully grasp the totality of the several ideas presented. That being said, it is a magisterial presentation of a crucial compilation of cellular biology. Thank you!
Thank you, Morton! If there are any questions please feel free to ask and I'll try to answer to the best of my knowledge. I will admit that the information is a bit of a smorgasbord of information. I had a lot going on and a lot of papers to read and eventually it all got away from me. My thoughts also changed while writing which explains my last segment so I also understand why it may be confusing.
She also points out the difference between the clinical trial vaccine production where it was high quality and hand-made, vs the stuff they are using now, which is apparently nowhere near as QC'd.
I'll take a look at it later and see about the LNP. I think it's so difficult to ascertain if someone has a bad batch and what that could mean, although at the same time part of me wouldn't be surprised if such a thing happened. Overall, the vaccines having some similar presentations with COVID infection may lead me more to being concerned about the delivery system and the possible cytotoxicity of the spike protein. Granted, the number of varied neurological issues may mean something else is at play. There's so much going on and not enough people trying to figure out that at the end of the day it just becomes exhausting trying to rationalize and make sense of the information.
"so much going on and not enough people trying to figure out that at the end of the day it just becomes exhausting trying to rationalize and make sense of the information"
Pretty much nails why these vaccines should be taking so much longer to trial. The EUA was unnecessary and grotesque.
I may have forgot to mention, but unlike sequential exposure to viruses which may acclimate the body to the antigens through immunity, lipid nanoparticles are unlikely to do the same. Considering that constant vaccination supposedly creates greater neutralizing titers, we have to assume that the LNPs are not targeted before they can present mRNA to host cells which then produce the spike protein. Only then, with the presentation of spike protein can an immune response target these spike proteins and cause the body to produce antibodies.
I know some studies have come out about it. I haven't looked into it extensively to discuss it properly.
As for the LNP they are intentionally cationic to interact with our negatively charged phospholipid bilayers. The issue is whether anything about their structure may be dangerous, including the length of the side chains or anything else for that matter. However, I do think that the main difference is that the cation is a positively charged amine which is either quartenary (has 4 things bonded to it to give it the + charge) or tertiary (3 things bonded) and possibly is positively charged due to the physiological pH. The big issue is determining if those lipid nanoparticles are eliciting an immune response, although LNPs have been deployed in many different fashions to as a drug delivery mechanism for a while now. Because of this it's probably my least concern out of the 3 but it doesn't mean it still shouldn't be examined.
I've seen that going around. One thing to think about is if fat cells would then be producing the spike protein, or if this would mean the spike protein production may be halted, in which case the immune response and antibody production may be severely lowered as well. It'd be difficult to assess because the elderly are already undergoing immunosenecense and so their immune system would not be function properly already, and the obese also have immune dysnfunction as well.
I think one thing to rectify is the presentation of lipids as well. Because the LNPs are cationic on their surface that dynamic has to be taken into consideration. Expression and dynamics of the cell membrane are what's important for the LNP to target them and enter into cells. Although fat cells may contain higher levels of lipids it would not be a concern if the lipids are sequestered within the cell I believe.
As for any possibly free floating lipids such as those that may accumulate along the lining of blood vessels, the question is if the LNPs and subsequently the mRNA would be broken down. Otherwise, if they sit there intact I can still see them causing problems, including if they migrate to nearby epithelial cells lining the blood vessels. Also, if they are not breaking down then these may essentially act as time bombs waiting for a chance to migrate and enter into cells.
Now, even with all that being said, one caveat may be that fat may provide some sort of emulsifying effect that may actually break up the lipids, in which case that hypothesis may be viable.
Anyways I'm speaking off the cuff and unless we actually perform studies it'd be hard to assess for ourselves!
The more I think about it, the more interesting this is -- maybe you should write it up for Medical Hypotheses or some other journal.
This might explain why top-tier athletes are so prone to vaccine injury, especially in aerobic sports. They run high levels of ER stress from exertion (a quick search turned up https://journals.lww.com/acsm-msse/Fulltext/2011/01000/Endoplasmic_Reticulum_Stress_Markers_and.4.aspx). They also generally have high levels of toxins, because they eat very high calorie diets, so will have high intakes of food toxins (polyunsaturated fats, excess retinol and beta-carotene, glyphosate, aluminum, fluoride); all of these toxins increase ER stress.
Of course we should measure ER stress before vaccination, and periodically afterwards... Just one more test we could have checked before vaccinating billions of people.
You've hit on everything I was going to include but kept it shorter for my own sanity. I was thinking of writing about measuring ER Stress markers (I mentioned an observational study that did so in COVID pneumonia patients) and I would hope that doctors who read this post may be inspired to think of such tests to conduct. Otherwise, I do have some in mind as well!
And I also included a literature review (I think in here as well) that mentioned ER Stress markers tend to increase in rigorous exercise, although it evens out afterwards which may indicate a slight beneficial role. But I will admit I didn't even take into consideration the athletes! And it would also require that timing of the vaccination be taken into account as well. So many variables, so many perspectives, and so few people being concerned!
ER stress can be extremely harmful, for sure. Lyons-Weiler's model is that it causes autoimmunity and can trigger autism. https://ipaknowledge.org/ASD-Causality-Model.php
Full paper at https://ipaknowledge.org/resources/LYONSWEILER%20A1%202019%20b.pptx
I tend to be very hesitant in attributing autism to various causative agents, but I'll look into it and see what can be pieced together if possible. I wouldn't be surprised if there are plenty of factors to autism rather than one genetic factor but I always prefer to be hesitant in my thinking with respect to autism.
Lyons-Weiler wrote a book, The Environmental and Genetic Causes of Autism, that reviewed over 2,000 research papers, so he's pretty knowledgable. The genetic susceptibility is primarily to environmental toxins and nutritional deficiencies, we don't have "autism genes" per se. No individual genetic variant has high correlation.
Another good resource is vaccinepapers.org, which includes full-text copies of the research it cites.
For background rates, Blaxill and Olmstead's book is impeccable: Denial: How Refusing to Face the Facts about Our Autism Epidemic Hurts Children, Families, and Our Future
Thanks for the comment. I'll keep an open mind and perspective and I'll check those books out when possible. I think my backlog of books I should be reading is several dozen as of now, so maybe I should go back to reading some books!
LOL indeed, I've been feeling the same way. Just too much worthwhile stuff coming in, like this article :-)
I went down a similar path in my cancer etiology proposal - that inducing a cell to churn out a protein without destroying it afterward (as a virus does during lysis) will probably result in metabolic disruption. I proposed metaplasia / conversion to secreting phenotypes (https://unglossed.substack.com/p/liquid-cancer) - but stress cascades make sense as well.
Spike is loaded with N, which has a role in folding quality checks via during-translation-glycosylation. I wonder if that would exacerbate or evade ER inflammatory signaling; the latter might make sense since viruses don't like inflammation. I haven't looked into the world of folding from the cell's side yet. ER stress as the etiology for myocarditis sounds like a promising angle. The Zhang citation is great (a lot of really good citations throughout) - though I'm having trouble determining how they are using some of the key phrases at first glance. Language barrier.
If mRNA is transfecting pituitary / pineal cells, then there's your blood-brain barrier bypassed as far as excreted spike. That's been my hunch as far as the neurological effects. This could also account for menstrual disruption (whether via spike or mRNA-metabolic-disruption), and has some really scary implications (rapid aging). *comment edited for typos
Man, there was one paper I was reading about cancer and ER stress. It's somewhere in my tabs...somewhere but I'd rather not misquote them. There are indications that the spike protein may trigger inflammatory signaling, but what would be interesting is if the folding of the protein and post-translational modification contributes in some manner. With UPR it appears that just checking if proteins are misfolded is enough to trigger UPR and ER Stress. Even with these papers there's still so much to cover.
I'll check that paper again. There is an issue of scientists not following similar nomenclature or using their own preferred terms which can make it confusing.
I tried looking into endometriosis, wondering if there may be accumulation of LNP within the reproductive tract. There is one study I saw examining ER Stress in endometriosis. The pituitary/pineal thought is interesting.
This has given me a lot to think about and I'll check out your cancer paper as well!
Edit Edit: I referred to the wrong paper! Sorry a lot of the names are blurring together! I thought you were referring to the Zha et. al. study. I'll examine the paper again and let me know if there's anything in particular that's confusing.
It's only confusing because I haven't done more than skim. The way they employ "ER stress" as a verb in multiple contexts makes it clear that it has to be read carefully (as any study should be anyway).
Thank you for this different perspective about the vaccines and covid infections. I appreciate it. 👍🏼💜
I have a BS biology and a minor in chemistry, and it would have really helped me to more clearly know what ER stood for (I had to really look for it) and a a short paragraph about that process of ER stress. (From the title I thought you were talking about doctors in the emergency room. 😄).
oh apologies! I guess at this point I was just thinking of it from the perspective of the Fluvoxamine lead up, so I assumed most people had ER as endoplasmic reticulum in mind! I'll make sure to be careful about that in the future. As you can tell I'm really not one to make good titles!
Thank you Tim for alerting me to this article. This reference might be of interest - https://www.researchgate.net/publication/327231523_Autism_is_an_Acquired_Cellular_Detoxification_Deficiency_Syndrome_with_Heterogeneous_Genetic_Predisposition
As I stated to Tim I'm usually hesitant to attribute autism to any causative agent. I did skim over your paper and I do appreciate that it does approach it from a multifactorial approach. I'll try to read it over when available. Even if it's a highly controversial topic I would at least like to examine it with as much nuance as possible.
Thank you! I feel so much better, now learning that there may be a reason for my confusion in addition to my slightly addled brain.
No worries, it is lightly to be a result of my brain as well! Also, as a suggestion for future comments it may be easier to reply to the comment thread by clicking on the reply button underneath someone's comment. It'll help keep the conversation organized. Hope that helps!
I will have to re-read a couple more times as the complexities have sometimes overwhelmed my admittedly diminished capabilities to fully grasp the totality of the several ideas presented. That being said, it is a magisterial presentation of a crucial compilation of cellular biology. Thank you!
Thank you, Morton! If there are any questions please feel free to ask and I'll try to answer to the best of my knowledge. I will admit that the information is a bit of a smorgasbord of information. I had a lot going on and a lot of papers to read and eventually it all got away from me. My thoughts also changed while writing which explains my last segment so I also understand why it may be confusing.
Did you see this article?
LNPs and the vaccine in general are discussed: http://enformtk.u-aizu.ac.jp/howard/gcep_dr_vanessa_schmidt_krueger/
She also points out the difference between the clinical trial vaccine production where it was high quality and hand-made, vs the stuff they are using now, which is apparently nowhere near as QC'd.
I'll take a look at it later and see about the LNP. I think it's so difficult to ascertain if someone has a bad batch and what that could mean, although at the same time part of me wouldn't be surprised if such a thing happened. Overall, the vaccines having some similar presentations with COVID infection may lead me more to being concerned about the delivery system and the possible cytotoxicity of the spike protein. Granted, the number of varied neurological issues may mean something else is at play. There's so much going on and not enough people trying to figure out that at the end of the day it just becomes exhausting trying to rationalize and make sense of the information.
"so much going on and not enough people trying to figure out that at the end of the day it just becomes exhausting trying to rationalize and make sense of the information"
Pretty much nails why these vaccines should be taking so much longer to trial. The EUA was unnecessary and grotesque.
I may have forgot to mention, but unlike sequential exposure to viruses which may acclimate the body to the antigens through immunity, lipid nanoparticles are unlikely to do the same. Considering that constant vaccination supposedly creates greater neutralizing titers, we have to assume that the LNPs are not targeted before they can present mRNA to host cells which then produce the spike protein. Only then, with the presentation of spike protein can an immune response target these spike proteins and cause the body to produce antibodies.
Constant vaccination (for the same antigens) can also lead to T cell exhaustion and tolerance.
I was reading that the LNP is particularly icky due to being cationic?
I know some studies have come out about it. I haven't looked into it extensively to discuss it properly.
As for the LNP they are intentionally cationic to interact with our negatively charged phospholipid bilayers. The issue is whether anything about their structure may be dangerous, including the length of the side chains or anything else for that matter. However, I do think that the main difference is that the cation is a positively charged amine which is either quartenary (has 4 things bonded to it to give it the + charge) or tertiary (3 things bonded) and possibly is positively charged due to the physiological pH. The big issue is determining if those lipid nanoparticles are eliciting an immune response, although LNPs have been deployed in many different fashions to as a drug delivery mechanism for a while now. Because of this it's probably my least concern out of the 3 but it doesn't mean it still shouldn't be examined.
One hypothesis going around for myocarditis: LNP being absorbed in fat by fat people but not by skinny people: https://twitter.com/Undergroundcou1/status/1480161860477497348
I've seen that going around. One thing to think about is if fat cells would then be producing the spike protein, or if this would mean the spike protein production may be halted, in which case the immune response and antibody production may be severely lowered as well. It'd be difficult to assess because the elderly are already undergoing immunosenecense and so their immune system would not be function properly already, and the obese also have immune dysnfunction as well.
I think one thing to rectify is the presentation of lipids as well. Because the LNPs are cationic on their surface that dynamic has to be taken into consideration. Expression and dynamics of the cell membrane are what's important for the LNP to target them and enter into cells. Although fat cells may contain higher levels of lipids it would not be a concern if the lipids are sequestered within the cell I believe.
As for any possibly free floating lipids such as those that may accumulate along the lining of blood vessels, the question is if the LNPs and subsequently the mRNA would be broken down. Otherwise, if they sit there intact I can still see them causing problems, including if they migrate to nearby epithelial cells lining the blood vessels. Also, if they are not breaking down then these may essentially act as time bombs waiting for a chance to migrate and enter into cells.
Now, even with all that being said, one caveat may be that fat may provide some sort of emulsifying effect that may actually break up the lipids, in which case that hypothesis may be viable.
Anyways I'm speaking off the cuff and unless we actually perform studies it'd be hard to assess for ourselves!
Appreciate the time you take to reply.